Just curious, are you trying to imply that all meat eaters are obese?

As much as you had an upbeat attitude throughout your comment, it still seemed like you were “nicely” insulting those of us that eat meat.

To each there own, but honestly, my grandmother drove across Canada all by herself every year until she passed at the age of 91. She was healthy, active… and a meat eater.

Now I’m not trying to argue that one way is better then the other, but it would be nice if you didnt try to imply that all meat eaters are fat, unhealthy and going to die at an early age.

If you have done all of this research, I’m sure everyone would be interested in reading your thoughts on that, instead of most of your empty responses that don’t actually say anything factual or productive. I understand that you like to rile people up, and I respect that. It’s funny, everyone loves a good debate. But seriously, I’d love to hear you talk about this in a knowledgeable way.

Actually, smart cars are far better then SUVs, trucks, or cars. Car are better then SUVs and trucks, and SUVs and trucks are pretty much as bad. While that public transit is technically the best. As well, thanks to capitalism and explotationism, we have cars that perform very poorly fuel wise. What I was pointing out was not weither one was good or bad, but that what is done is extremely ineffecient.

Also, no, meat eating compared to mass murder is not a fair comparison. The comparison I was making was wasting 2’000x the energy growing meat, vs feeding the 15 million and more who die a year due to hunger. (15 million figure is only kids http://www.womenaid.org/press/info/food/food4.html)

As to the stabbing kitten and babies, I was (purposefully) mixing up things that a normal person would just not do to show an extreme.

To WMD :

Where you dropped as a child, or thrown? It’s one of those two, because nothing else can explain what you just said. “Oh hai, we rape and nuke peple aniway so why not jus eat meat the der are gonna eat ech other aniwai so lets nuke thm and eat them to!” Let’s address these points in order.

1: Animals are dirty. Some yes, most are since they have a tendency of being very mobile, and thus not needing to care about where they shit. Pigs, for instance, are very clean animals. They are the only farm animal that has a designated corner of the pen to shit. Animals are all clean to within themselves, humans tend to shove them into places were they can’t really clean themselves (also, if someone brings up stuff like mice carry diseases, remember, mice only carry diseases we can catch – it’s like if your perfume could kill a lemur, that’s you being toxic to it, but it doesn’t affect you).

2: Animals aren’t conscious. This one could be a big dousie to tackle, but put mildly. . . There’s a cat that befriended a crow; crows can solve puzzles and can teach other crows (such as warning them what house has a human that kills crows); pigs and dogs have loyalty; chimps wage war, use tools and weaponry; and I could probably go on with quite a few more things. This is more then enough to put most of these animals above some people I know. You can read more here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Animal_cognition#Research_questions Granted, you probably won’t.

3: We have bacteria that processess meat. BUAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Where in the hell did you hear this? Seriously, there’s speaking out of your ass and then there’s. . . Whatever that is. We have to cook all meats and dump ammonia into a lot of our meats (http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/31/us/31meat.html?pagewanted=all) AND keep the damn things frozen or they go bad overnight, and you think we somehow have a bacteria that processes’ it? We die from bacteria we catch FROM meat.

4: I can shoot a cow and the other won’t care. (disturbing video link) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gkcxrbviu-A yes, this cow didn’t look completely disturbed and freaking puzzled as to what killed/happened it’s buddy before getting shot it’s self.

5: People are mean to people so let’s be mean to animals! “You can judge a man’s true character by the way he treats his fellow animals.”

Wow, I apparently need to learn how to type… *both

@charles

Your first comment was great, very to the point. Your second, however, was flawed.

“And people around the world are going to keep drowning kitten, stabbin’ babies, driving SUVs and wasting energy, and exposing people to warcrimes by doing things like ripping their scrotum skin off. Does that mean we should stop upholding the Geneva convention, stop improving fuel mileage, stop funding kid’s help desk, and start stabbin’ us some more kittens?”

First off, I thought they were drowning kittens and stabbing babies, in the end they are stabbing kittens? Where do you live? It sounds horrible. Second, I don’t thing that comparing what vegans are pushing to something like the kid’s help desk or the Geneva convention is a fair analogy. PS. most new SUV’s are greener… with that, people driving said new SUV’s are actually ‘improving fuel mileage” (though I’m shock THAT was your arguement and not that they harm the environment).. Just saying.

You are bashing vegans on what a small subgroup of them do. You state that “Each living vegan is negatively impacting the plant and animal kingdom.” when they are trying their best to make up for some of the problems humans have caused.

Killing and eating animals is sometimes necessary, breeding genetically modified freak animals for slaughter is not. Industrial meat is pumped full of hormones to increase the amount of meat that can be produced from a single animal and antibiotics to counter the unsanitary conditions on factory farms. The animals are fed cheap grain and waste in order to decrease the cost of raising the animal and increase corporate profit margins. Don’t be thinking they are mooching about chomping on grass.

About now you are wondering why I’m not vegan, I think that one person choosing not to eat tasty meat is not going to change much, though it likely would be healthier. I understand why some vegans are going to want to spread the word about the problems with the meat industry, they know just by themselves it’s not going to change much but if they can inform other people about their beliefs they might make more of an impact.

And people around the world are going to keep drowning kitten, stabbin’ babies, driving SUVs and wasting energy, and exposing people to warcrimes by doing things like ripping their scrotum skin off. Does that mean we should stop upholding the Geneva convention, stop improving fuel mileage, stop funding kid’s help desk, and start stabbin’ us some more kittens?

You logic, she is flawless. Like a sunken boat.

Doubt I’ll post here more then once unless this site warns me of other comments, but I would like to point out that this statement is exceedingly wrong. The food you eat at the end is often, if not always, processed heavily – either that or it usually have a heavy labour cost in actually harvesting it. The food given to animals is generally more of a mish mash (making sure there aren’t bug in your flour is a lot more required then making sure there aren’t bugs in the cow feed).

Animal meat gives a relatively similar amount of calorie per pound as other foodstuffs (beef gives around 450 calories per 200 grams, grains around 700 per 200, soy around 375 per 250, 200 per 165). It takes an average of 7 to 10 times the amount of grain to get a grain-fed animal into the world (http://www.peta.org/issues/animals-used-for-food/meat-wastes-natural-resources.aspx), not to count the water difference as well as the massive increase in land (http://www.earthsave.ca/articles/enviro/why_does.html). So yes, you end up starving a good portion of the world to have meat, making it incredible none sustainable (and thusly, something you probably won’t have in the next few hundred years without eating stemcell beef (C) or being mega-wealthy).

Also, farmers are some one of the most heavily subsidized groups in the world (meaning, the government gives them money to stay afloat without problem). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agricultural_subsidy (look at the section on US and EU) – before anyone points out that meat isn’t in there, feed is animal food, which just leaves terrain rental and water usage for your meat. This point invalidates your “they have to make money” statement as they get free-cash handed out to them. In case you can’t think that far out, this is mostly done to prevent loss of security in developed nations (that way, africa doesn’t supply the US with 90% of it’s food and one day go “Hey, you know what? Let ‘em starve”. You can replace africa with whatever country you don’t particularly like).

Your logic is killing my brain, how about that?

“It is not very healthy for your body to be a vegetarian, not to mention the extreme vegan version”

Remarkably remarkably false, and proof you have only researched the “my-view-only” way. Everything you need (even B-12 in certain forms of sea-weed, granted, the bio-availability being none-existent of B-12 from meat is heavily debated as one of the reasons a lot of people suffer when they are older, so let’s leave that storm out of this argument). Beans give you good iron, most vitamins are only found in plants, soy (tofu especially) gives you great magnesium and manganese, and you could easily go on with everything else. The complimentary protein myth has been massively debunked, so as long as you don’t try living off only one food (and living off only beef = you die anyways), you’re safe.

“On the other hand, it isn’t natural for humans to be herbivores! We evolved from primeapes, and they eat meat when given the chance. The chimpanzee, a perfect example.”

Chimps rarely eat meat (around 3% of the time), and they also eat baby chimps. So, I assume since they eat baby chimp we should start having human baby back ribs, since you state “do like the chimps, eat some meat!” The rest of the apes are basically herbivores, with some exceptions (then again, I can link you a videos of a cow eating a baby chicken and a wolf eating berries and grass – so only propose we are “omnivores” if you’re a imbecile from this point on). Send me an e-mail if you want to debate more, but honestly, it sounds like most of the debates here are either pro animal nuts, or pro meta eating nuts, so at least have some fuel for your fire.

I’m a vegan, two years running, who only has honey as his none-vegan thing. – Ah, there is a notify via e-mail button, jolly-o.

Vegans, eat only plants, and anything that isn’t meat or dairy. Vegans diet also includes the wide spectrum of bread,flour, grain, etc.

It is not very healthy for your body to be a vegetarian, not to mention the extreme vegan version. Salad and say quiche, for dinner won’t be that filling. So, to supplement your dinner would probably be grains, white flour products, and the like. Carbohydrate supplements do not give you much of anything in regard to iron, protein, and such needed minerals needed to keep your body in proper homeostasis condition. All the vegans I know are not in great health. Most vegans would refuse to take dietary supplements because of what the pills casing is made of, or because it isn’t natural to take pills for nutrition.

On the other hand, it isn’t natural for humans to be herbivores! We evolved from primeapes, and they eat meat when given the chance. The chimpanzee, a perfect example. We evolved into omnivores, and it is just plain stupid to go backwards on thousands of generations of adaptations.

If you don’t want animals to die, or get abused, or whatever then do something about it! Being passive and thinking you are helping by not eating meat is a very close-minded way of thinking. You can petition for humane farms and such, but being passive won’t change the world.

This is my rant from study hall, and I look forward to lamb chops for dinner! My family buys meat from organic humane upstate NY farms instead of companies such as Murray’s.

Think of what you can do that extends beyond your house.

I put up with the following questions and remarks daily:
- What do you EAT?
- How do you get protein?
- The animals are going to die anyway.
- Do you eat bread?
- Just eat meat this once, it won’t kill you.
- You USED to like -insert meat-related dish-
- Vegan food is gross.

It’s really obnoxious to hear these ignorant comments, in addition to having meat shoved in my face quite often. It’s just the same as a Christian getting on a Muslim’s case for wearing a hijab. Would you tell a Muslim woman to “take of her scarf because it isn’t a big deal, just this once”? I don’t care if you eat meat. But if you shove your god damn beliefs down my throat, you better be ready to get the same response from me.