The Pope was just a very mean man. He made some remarks that were esteem-inabling [related article, related article]. He un-thoughtfully implied that Islamic Jihad, the calling of a holy war, was somehow “unreasonable”. I suppose the Pope will defend his remarks by citing several decades of historical precedence for Islamic calls for violence against innocent women and children, including the 9/11 blindside suckerpunch. And sure, perhaps hundreds of rockets were launched recently into Jewish cities with the purpose of mutilating elderly women and burning children alive.
But that doesn’t give the Pope the right to free speech, and certainly not the right to call these acts unreasonable. I mean… just look at the peacelovers in these pictures shown here? Look at how hurt they are? Your heart goes out to them. So emotionally gloomed by the Pope’s mean remarks that they collectively pull each other through this with their time-tested regimen of yoga, chocolate binging, and burning effigies. This is just one of hundreds (probably thousands) of times that these peace-loving followers have been coerced by some mean words from mean people into burning effigies, burning flags, and burning Jews. How peaceful.
They are so peaceful. The Pope is so mean to imply that Jihad, the forcible spreading of their peace using weapons, is possibly wrong or evil. That is so mean. In the States we would even call that “devisive”, which here is a step lower than “murderous raping cannibal”.
The Pope should take a lesson from fellow Christians and focus outrage on real evils, like showing Jesus’ face in a bar glass. And to think, Christians used to waste their time whining about fetuses being cut open while still alive and having their brains sucked out.
Or the Pope could take a lesson from the liberals and focus his outrage on Wal-Mart, who might not kill women and children in cold blood… and may not saw the heads off living heroes and rape 9-yr-old girls… but Wal-Mart does something even more dispicable, they make money. When not fighting Wal-Mart liberals can be found wheeling soda machines out of public schools.
Maybe the Islamo-fascists could take a lesson from their close friends in the gay community… as Elton John has just ended his jihad with George Michael.
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Pope Benedict XVI was very courageous in saying what needs to be said in regards to Islamo-Fascism. And he hasn’t apologized for what he said. He just said he is sorry that the Muslims were offended.
But, I guess the Muslims can’t handle the truth.
By the way, leftists have come out and renounced the Pope’s comments.
Here is what one liberal blogger posted.
http://melt212.livejournal.com/171321.html
“I feel empathy for the muslims who just got bitch slapped by the pope because I had a boyfriend like that once. ”
Spoken like a true member of the Democratic Party base. Treats foreign affairs like it was the Jerry Springer show.
Hmm… Sticky subject here. The problem that most westeners have with the concept of Jihad stems from the time of the Crusades onward. The term “Jihad” itself simply means a holy task to which you — for a time — apply your life to. For example, raising a child could be considered “Jihad”, building a community mosque could be considered “Jihad” and, as is most familiar to us, waging a what you believe to be a holy war could be considered Jihad.
It’s a bit like the term “Kung Fu” which westeners take to mean a style of martial arts, but which actually means “hard work” or “dedicated work.” (Learning piano, for example, could be considered “Kung Fu”. Tell that to a westener and suddenly you get a mental picture of Hong Kong Phooey karate chopping a piano.)
Anyway, during the Crusades, the term “Jihad” was taken to mean “Holy War” since at that time, for that particular task, there was a Jihad — a holy work — toward the Ismamization of Jerusalem. Since then, the term “Jihad” has had the same conotation to us as the term “Crusade” does to them. While a “Crusade” is not necessarily a “holy war” to us, to them that’s exactly what it means.
The problem arises then from the following: some people feel that one of the pillars of Islam is to engage in Jihad, in some great work. To those whose meaning of “Jihad” is synonymous with “Holy War”… well, you can see where misunderstandings here stem from.
Now, this isn’t to say that some Muslims don’t consider their Jihad to be a holy war against the west — they obviously do — but it’s that confusion which has caused a “hijacking” (to use the President’s word) of the Islamic faith.
Don’t give me your words, give me your definitions. — Albert Einstein
As for the Pope’s words — he just read a historical text. Unfortunately, he chose to read text where “Jihad” was said to mean “holy war” exclusively. While I agree with the feeling that the words may revive the feelings of the Crusades, some of us feel that unforutunately these feelings have already been revived by folks the like of Osama bin Laden, who have openly declared war on the west under the banner of “Convert or Die”, and by all those who haven’t worked with us to stop them.
I wonder what this period will be refered to as in a thousand years (if we make it that long)?
*Note: I’m not a muslim. I have read the Koran and I have a number of Muslim friends who have taken the time to help me better understand Islam. While I am in disagreement with them over a number of fundamental issues (for example, our differing ideas on the attainment of salvation; one is by grace, the other is by strict adherence to the laws), I understand the faith enough to know not all is as we in the west understand them to be. Those who would call themselves Christ-followers as opposed to Christians understand intrinsically the difference between Muslims and Islamists.
The Pope has only suggested that no human should ever have to suffer such indignities as those witnessed by his friend Oriana Fallacci. Her father was part of the underground that fought to overthrow Mussolini. Despite her life-long atheism, she had a private audience with the Pope last Summer at Castelgandolfo. It is said they called each other ‘friend.’ She fought breast cancer for the last 15 years, and the fricking Italian and Swiss court systems cases against her for her books inciting us to all WAKE UP ABOUT THE REALITY OF THE EVIL IN ISLAM. The venomous leftist press in Italy are apparently all tributes and praises this morning–SURPRISE! Ironically, Oriana passed away last night at 77. It has been reported she received the sacraments in her final moments, reconciling her lifelong Atheism with the Catholicism of her own culture.
So the question becomes, what are WE willing to do about it?
For a little motivation, imagine yourself somewhere in this picture. That’s where Islam plans for you to spend your life, followed by a relaxing eternity in torturous hellfire, alternately burning off then regrowing your skin with your privates in the hands of Allah.
No matter what happens next, as of now, with the threats of war bubbling up from the biggest maniacs of them all, you are with the Pope, or you are with Sharia. The fence is not a side.
From Oriana Fallaci’s The Rage and Pride
“I am not speaking, obviously, to the laughing hyenas who enjoy seeing images of the wreckage and snicker good–it–serves–the–Americans–right. I am speaking to those who, though not stupid or evil, are wallowing in prudence and doubt. And to them I say: “Wake up, people. Wake up!!” Intimidated as you are by your fear of going against the current—that is, appearing racist (a word which is entirely inapt as we are speaking not about a race but about a religion)—you don’t understand or don’t want to understand that a reverse–Crusade is in progress. Accustomed as you are to the double–cross, blinded as you are by myopia, you don’t understand or don’t want to understand that a war of religion is in progress. Desired and declared by a fringe of that religion, perhaps, but a war of religion nonetheless. A war which they call Jihad. Holy War. A war that might not seek to conquer our territory, but that certainly seeks to conquer our souls. That seeks the disappearance of our freedom and our civilization. That seeks to annihilate our way of living and dying, our way of praying or not praying, our way of eating and drinking and dressing and entertaining and informing ourselves. You don’t understand or don’t want to understand that if we don’t oppose them, if we don’t defend ourselves, if we don’t fight, the Jihad will win. And it will destroy the world that for better or worse we’ve managed to build, to change, to improve, to render a little more intelligent, that is to say, less bigoted—or even not bigoted at all. And with that it will destroy our culture, our art, our science, our morals, our values, our pleasures…[oath]! Don’t you realize that the Osama Bin Ladens feel authorized to kill you and your children because you drink wine or beer, because you don’t wear your beard long or a chador, because you go to the theater or the movies, because you listen to music and sing pop songs, because you dance in discos or at home, because you watch TV, wear miniskirts or short–shorts, because you go [inappropriate] to the beach or the pool, because you [inappropriate] when you want [inappropriate]? Don’t you even care about that, you fools? I am an atheist, thank God. And I have no intention of letting myself be killed for it.”
“To make you cry I’ll tell you about the twelve young impure men I saw executed at Dacca at the end of the Bangladesh war. They executed them on the field of Dacca stadium, with bayonet blows to the torso or abdomen, in the presence of twenty thousand faithful who applauded in the name of God from the bleachers. They thundered “Allah akbar, Allah akbar.” Yes, I know: the ancient Romans, those ancient Romans of whom my culture is so proud, entertained themselves in the Coliseum by watching the deaths of Christians fed to the lions. I know, I know: in every country of Europe the Christians, those Christians whose contribution to the History of Thought I recognize despite my atheism, entertained themselves by watching the burning of heretics. But a lot of time has passed since then, we have become a little more civilized, and even the sons of Allah ought to have figured out by now that certain things are just not done. After the twelve impure young men they killed a little boy who had thrown himself at the executioners to save his brother who had been condemned to death. They smashed his head with their combat boots. And if you don’t believe it, well, reread my report or the reports of the French and German journalists who, horrified as I was, were there with me. Or better: look at the photographs that one of them took. Anyway this isn’t even what I want to underline. It’s that, at the conclusion of the slaughter, the twenty thousand faithful (many of whom were women) left the bleachers and went down on the field. Not as a disorganized mob, no. In an orderly manner, with solemnity. They slowly formed a line and, again in the name of God, walked over the cadavers. All the while thundering Allah–akbar, Allah–akbar. They destroyed them like the Twin Towers of New York. They reduced them to a bleeding carpet of smashed bones.”
See… this is why I love blogging.
Jeff :: Oh boy, I read that liberal blogger you linked to… do you think she’s carrying just a little baggage?
gnorb :: Some good perspective. I liked your historical context of ‘jihad’… I learned something today.
I especially appreciated the constrast between Christian and Christ-follower (as I try to always think of myself as the latter). I will add one very important point, and that is that despite apparent explanations that this could just be from a mis-understanding of words the Muslim world experienced the same misunderstanding with Danish pictures/cartoons. Their ability to be disagreed with is non-existent.
Fence Is No Side :: I will read your inclusions soon, and thanks for adding them. I heartily agree with you that it appears with non-Western Muslims that they literally cannot tolerate anyone thinking they are wrong, or even thinking differently from them theologically. They get violent in response to cartoons (a stark contrast with Christians who are routinely and often hatefully lampooned in all forms of Western media with little incident).
Interesting post, and here’s a comment from a Muslim!
The pope obviously being a representative of the Christian faith, should be and in the past previous popes have been very careful in what they say about other faiths. There hasn’t been an issue in the past, and seems like these are the personal views of the pope, who does not have an understanding of tems such as Jihad, which gnorb has defined well. I can and can’t blame the pope for his lack of understanding, As the head of the Christian faith one would think that he’d gain knowledge about a faith before commenting. On the flip side, many Muslim’s themselves aren’t aware what Jihad means so how can a non-Muslim be expected to know. I’d also like to say that personally I have a problem with the way that the above pictured demonstrations are carried out, as they portray an incorrect and misrepresentative image of Islam as has been clearly demonstrated by the contents of this blog and again a lack of knowledge about Islam. Events such as the above should not be misconstrued with what Islam is about, just as attrocities that are unknown due to media blackouts by Israelis against palestinians do not repesent the jewish faith and just as Hitler’s actions do not represent the Christian faith. Sterotyping and blanket assumptions are dangerous and frankly senseless.
I do however understand the perspective that you have and the majority of western non-muslims have as they are based on what the media release, which is partial and devoid of “both sides of the story”.
Have a good one.
Taz
Taz :: Thanks for your thoughts. I was hoping to hear a Muslim perspective.
Be sure that when I refer to Isalmo-fascists in my blog post that I am referring to just that… the portion of Islam that promotes this type of animal-like violence. If what you are saying is correct then this may be a very small sliver… but I have a feeling that the sliver is bigger than most Muslims admit.
And just like I’m sure there are misconceptions I have about Islam, you seem to have a few misconceptions about Christianity and the Western world. That’s fine though… everyone is limited to their own perspective… which is why I don’t think anyone should be silent for fear of being wrong. And the people in the pictures I posted simply do not have any understanding about anything.
The Pope is not the leader of Christianity. He is well respected, though, even by most non-Catholics. His remarks were only words… and someone else’s quotations at that. Nothing the Pope did merited the reaction that is happening in the Islamic world… not just the reaction of the idiots I pictured, but the reaction of the major media outlets in the Arab states. Seriously, when does a historial quote equate to violent acts? It does’t, unless one is stoned, stupid, or completely nuts.
When was the last time Christians released a video of them holding a gun to the head of a Muslim? Until that happens as many times as we’ve seen a Muslim holding a gun to the head of an ‘infidel’, then - in my opinion - the peaceful Muslims should spend their waking moments continually writing and sending apology letters to Jews and Westerners… or in lieu of that they could hunt down the bad apples in their own areas.
Bear in mind that there were Muslim riots over Danish cartoons. Cartoons?!?! Perhaps I’m not interpreting “riot” correctly. Perhaps the word “cartoon” is getting lost in trans-atlantic translation. Or… perhaps… the fact that Christian riots aren’t filling Western and Arab TV screens right now (and Muslim riots currently are) is a very telling truth.
We have a word for when someone hears “Several hundred years ago this guy said that your God sucks” and responds with screams of “I’m going to burn you alive and send you and your family into eternal damnation”… the word is “kray-zee-ess-oh-bee”. To live in peace, kray-zee-ess-oh-bee’s must be destroyed. It has come to that. Westerners are faced with a choice from radical Islamists: kill us, convert to Islam, or be killed yourselves. Guess which one we’re going to choose?
However, it would be much more peaceful for us if fellow Muslims would police their own radicals… but I don’t see it happening right now. Do you have any ideas toward this end?
Hi there Waraxe, thanks for the response to my comments.
Civilised dialogue is always good which is why i’m here! 
Just to clarify another point, islamo-facists as you label, are in no way a portion of Islam, just as Neo-Nazi’s are in no way a portion of christianity. Ranting and raving Islamic or jewish or christian slogans and verses does not by any stretch of the logical mind validate that the person in question is a true follower of that respective faith. Although i’m a Muslim, I am also a humanitarian and the animal-like violence that you refer to is abhorred by me also. This uncivilised behaviour has been exhibited not only by the islamo-facists that you have validly stated, but also by the US and UK troops who have abused POW’s in Iraq etc as per media coverage which has been an embarrassment for the Allied troops. Just as those troops are not reflective of the US or British army, similarly the extemists that you refer to are not reflective of Muslims as a whole, I being one.
I am somewhat perturbed that the nature of this blog is ironically similar to the nature of the people that you refer to, i.e. the Islamo-facists are extreme haters, yet this blog is analagous in that it’s demonstrating extreme hatred towards Islam as a whole! Just an observation by me.
Totally agree with you, the only way we are to learn and resolve these misconceptions that people have amongst each other is to talk, without fear of thinking that they are saying something wrong.
I think I said that he’s a representative of the christian faith rather than what you said which is referring to him being the leader of Christianity, so there is a significant difference. The papacy however is supposed to be flawless according to catholicism which verifies that these are his own views which is fine as he’s entitled to them and his own views are not expected to be flawless.
I think there needs to be a greater understanding of why there is this animosity between the 3 main faiths, Judaism, christianity and Islam.
Islam and Christianity until very recently have been ok, although this occurrence may have caused issues. People in the west, myself included need to understand what is really going on in the rest of the world, in palestine and israel and lebonan to understand why there is extremism. Not just base their opinions and comments on what they see in the media where as you state gun toting muslims are shown with the barrels pointing towards the heads of westerners. There is mass bombing going on in palestine by the israelis’ who are supplied with weapons and supplied by the west for example. To me there is no difference between these ppl who hold guns to ppl’s heads and those who supply the weapons knowingly to wipe out entire families. They are both as bad as each other, although in one instance several lives are lost…..
You refer to peaceful muslims which i feel is incorrect. I again state that the people who perpetrate crimes against humanity are not following Islam. So the Muslims don’t have any responsibility towards those people who are extreme and lost and have interpreted whateever they want to for a misguided act. Just as all jews don’t need to write apology letters to whole palestinian families that have been massacred by israeli soldiers, just as all christians do not need to write to ethnic groups in the UK where the right wing extremists have bombed their houses.
Again it’s all down to not having the facts and making sweeping judgments based on personal feelings rather than facts.
We need to separate this from religion as Bill Clinton said last week. We need to deal with the terrorists for what they are, terrorists, not bound by Islam or christianity or judaism. IF we can do that we will be ok. If not then all i fear is lost.
Recently with the lebonan occupation by Israeli’s which is clearly illegal according to the world, are you aware that extreme christian evangelists agree with what is going on? Does this mean that we all start labelling Chistians as facists and ask them to police the evangelists. I think now.
Well it’s end of work day here now.
Interested to see what you have to say.
Take care
Taz
I love the post! It’s speaks the truth perfectly. I love the part about the yoga and chocolate binging. Keep up the posts!
“The term “Jihad” itself simply means a holy task to which you — for a time — apply your life to.”
gnorb - Interesting thoughts. I was wondering - where did you get the above definition from? I thought the word ‘jihad’ was Arabic for ’strife’ with a non-religious etymology (until the Crusades). Just curious as to your sourcing behind holy task. Thanks.
Mike: That definition was what was explained to me. While “strife” did enter the conversation at that point (I remember making the same argument), because of the conotation “strife” brings to English speakers, the term “holy task” was instead used, which both explained the importance with which the task was undertaken and the fact that the “jihad” is a task, not a war.
(Translations are a wonderful thing. While the meaning of two words may be the same, the feeling with which they’re spoken can be light years appart.)
Over time (and 1000 years *is* a really long time), the Jihad has been taken with the importance of a holy task, or if you want to put it non-religiously, a really really really important and difficult task which is being done for a greater good (outside just yourself). In truth, however, the task is often seen as doing the work of God, which muddies the waters yet again. After all, is not all that we do the work of God if we do it with a mindfulness of the Almighty?
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